* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. ONE IS 2 4 1 0 0 3. [Human Relations Commission on June 15, 2026.] [00:00:03] UH, RACE DISCRIMINATION AND EMPLOYMENT AND RETALIATION. UH, THIS IS THE ONE THAT YOU HEARD THE APPEAL LAST TIME WE MET. UH, IT'S JUST ON HERE BECAUSE THE CASE WAS STILL OPEN ON MY LAST REPORT. UH, THE COMPLAINANT, UH, THE ALLEGED ACTIVE DISCRIMINATION HAD OCCURRED ABOUT A YEAR, CLOSE TO A YEAR AGO. UH, AND, UH, IT WAS ALSO BEING ADJU HAD BEEN ADJUDICATED BY THE EQUAL EMPLOYMENT OPPORTUNITIES COMMISSION. YOU REMEMBER THAT ONE? THE COMPLAINANT CAME AND APPEALED THE DISMISSAL AND THE COMMISSION UPHELD THE DISMISSAL. SO THAT CASE IS ALSO FINISHED. OKAY. UH, SO THAT BRINGS US MORE TO THE CURRENT DATE, UH, 2 4 1 0 1 8. AGE DISCRIMINATION IN EMPLOYMENT LEADING TO TERMINATION TO TERMINATION. UH, WE RECEIVED THE RESPONSE FROM THE RESPONDENT FROM THE EMPLOYER ON NOVEMBER 25TH, TRANSMITTED IT TO THE COMPLAINANT, AND THE INVESTIGATION IS CURRENTLY UNDERWAY. I, UH, DID INTERVIEW THE COMPLAINANT, GOT THEIR REACTION, UH, AND THERE'S A NUMBER OF WITNESSES. I'M IN THE PROCESS OF INTERVIEWING WITNESSES RIGHT NOW, AND, UH, I HOPE TO HAVE THAT WRAPPED UP BY NEXT MEETING. BUT IT'S A, UH, A LOT OF PEOPLE TO TALK TO. UH, SO THAT'S UNDERWAY. UH, 2 4 1 1 2 7 DISABILITY DISCRIMINATION, UH, IN EMPLOYMENT WITH TERMINATION AND RETALIATION. UH, THIS WAS FILED NOVEMBER 27TH. UH, MADE SEVERAL ATTEMPTS TO CONTACT THE COMPLAINANT TO SET UP THE INITIAL INTERVIEW. FINALLY, UH, I DID REACH THEM AND THEY AGREED TO AN INTERVIEW ON DECEMBER 19TH. UH, AND IT WAS ONE OF THESE SITUATIONS WHERE THE PERSON HAD A LOT OF, UH, ALLEGATIONS OF UNFAIR TREATMENT, BUT NONE OF THOSE RELATED TO ACTUAL DISCRIMINATION ON THE BASIS OF DISABILITY OR TO RETALIATION AS WE UNDERSTAND IT UNDER THE CODE. IT WAS, UH, AGAIN, A MATTER WHERE SOMEBODY ALLEGED THAT THEY'D BEEN TREATED VERY UNFAIRLY BY THEIR BOSS, BUT IT WAS NOT, UH, THEY COULD NOT SAY THAT IN THEIR OPINION IT WAS DUE TO ANY PROTECTED STATUS. SO, SO THAT CASE WAS DISMISSED. UH, 2 4 1 2 3 0. GETTING TO TOWARDS THE END OF THE SECOND PAGE, RACE DISCRIMINATION AND EMPLOYMENT LEADING DETERMINATION, UH, CONDUCTED THE INITIAL INTERVIEW, UH, JANUARY 7TH. SO WE'RE COMING UP TO THE PRESENT DAY HERE, DETERMINED THERE WAS REASONABLE SUSPICION OF A VIOLATION. UH, I WROTE UP THE CHARGE, AND THE COMPLAINANT IS GOING TO BE SIGNING THE CHARGE TOMORROW AT ONE O'CLOCK, AND WE'LL SEND IT OFF TO THE EMPLOYER, WHO WILL THEN HAVE 30 DAYS TO FILE THEIR, THEIR RESPONSE, SO THAT, THAT IS ACTIVE. AND THEN THE LAST 1, 2 5 0 1 0 8 DISABILITY DISCRIMINATION IN EMPLOYMENT. UH, I CONDUCTED THE INITIAL INTERVIEW ON THE 15TH, WHICH WOULD BE LIKE YESTERDAY. AND, UH, I DETERMINED THAT THERE WAS REASONABLE SUSPICION OF A VIOLATION IN THIS CASE. SO I, I WILL BE DRAFTING THE CHARGE AND THE COMPLAINANT WILL HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO REVIEW IT, AND WE'LL SEND IT OFF TO THE EMPLOYER AT THAT POINT. SO IF YOU'RE COUNTING, THERE'S THREE CASES THAT ARE ACTIVE RIGHT NOW. UH, 2 4 1 0 1-824-123-ZERO, AND 2 5 0 1, 0 8. ALL THE REST OF THEM, UH, HAVE BEEN CLOSED SINCE THE LAST REPORT. SO WITH THAT, I'LL TAKE A BREATH. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE HUMAN RIGHTS? UH, INVEST, JUST MY QUESTION IS, FROM A PERSONAL STANDPOINT, HOW FRUSTRATING IS IT FOR YOU TO HAVE ALL OF THESE THINGS THAT ARE FILED AND YOU DO X AMOUNT OF INVESTIGATING AND THEN THEY JUST DON'T COME THROUGH? IT'S, I, I DON'T KNOW, THE, WE COULD, YOU KNOW, CATEGORIZE FRUSTRATION. IT'S, UH, I GUESS THE DISAPPOINTMENT, THE FRUSTRATION IS, YOU KNOW, WHEN, WHEN PEOPLE COME IN FOR INITIAL INTERVIEW, YOU KNOW, I SAY, I'M GONNA, I JUST WANNA HEAR YOUR STORY. I'M GONNA, FOR TODAY'S PURPOSE, I'M GONNA BELIEVE WHAT YOU TELL ME. BUT THEY KNOW THAT EVERYTHING THEY'RE ALLEGING IT'S GONNA GET TO THE EMPLOYER. AND IF, AND, AND THEN I SAY, YOU KNOW, HAVE YOU EVER BEEN IN TROUBLE AT WORK BEFORE YOU EVER BEEN WRITTEN UP ANY SUSPENSION? NO, NO, NO. EVERYTHING'S BEEN CLEAN. WELL, AND THEN WHEN, WHEN I GET THE RESPONSE FROM THE EMPLOYER AND THERE'S A PERSONNEL FILE LIKE THIS, UH, AND I THINK THAT'S WHY, THAT'S WHY THEY BACK [00:05:01] OFF AT THAT POINT. IT WAS, I TELL YOU, JUST ON ONE OF THESE CASES, THERE WAS A MEDIATION ATTEMPTED THE PERSON SHOULD HAVE GRABBED AT THE OFFER. I MEAN, IT WAS NOT A BUNCH, IT WAS NOT A BUNCH OF MONEY, BUT IT WAS, I THINK, WHAT EMPLOYERS CALL NUISANCE MONEY. YOU KNOW, WILL I, I'M NOT GONNA NAME THE AMOUNT BECAUSE THE NEGOTIATIONS ARE, ARE SECRET, BUT IT WAS, YOU KNOW, IT WAS ENOUGH MONEY TO, TO MAKE THEM GO AWAY. AND THEY, THEY, NO, NO, I'M GONNA GET A LAWYER. I'M GONNA FIGHT THIS. 'CAUSE I SAW SOMEBODY GOT $80,000, YOU KNOW, FROM THE EEOC, AND, AND I SAID, YOU KNOW, I CAN'T EXPRESS AN OPINION, BUT YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE YOU HAVE A REAL STRONG CASE. 'CAUSE THAT PERSON PROBABLY HAD A REAL STRONG CASE, YOU KNOW, AND YOU NEED TO BE ABLE TO PROVE ALL YOUR ALLEGATIONS, AND THEY NEVER HEARD FROM THEM AGAIN. SO, SO I THINK SOMETIMES PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, WHEN THEY SEE THE EMPLOYER SIDE AND THEY SEE THERE'S DOCUMENTATION OF, YOU KNOW, ATTENDANCE, DISCIPLINARY RECORDS AND SO FORTH, THAT THEY HAVE A CHANGE OF HEART IN TERMS OF PURSUING THIS. I APPRECIATE THAT INFORMATION. FROM MY POINT OF VIEW, I DON'T THINK THE, UH, SYSTEM COULD BE MUCH BETTER FOR MUCH, MUCH MORE UNDERSTANDABLE FOR THE, UH, PEOPLE WHO WOULD BE COMPLAINANTS. YEAH. BUT THEY, THEY DO FALL THROUGH THIS TIME MORE OFTEN THAN NOT, IT SEEMS. YEAH. AND, UH, BUT I DO FEEL POSITIVE THAT THE THREE CASES WE HAVE ARE, ARE ALL ACTIVE CASES. AND, AND I, YOU KNOW, I'M HOPING THAT WE, WE GET FURTHER WITH THOSE, AND THIS IS KIND OF AN ONGOING POINT ON MY PART, BUT IN YOUR OPINION, DO YOU THINK THAT WE'VE DONE EVERYTHING TO, UH, PUBLICIZE THE AVAILABILITY OF THIS PROCEDURE THAT WE HAVE? THAT'S KIND OF A COM QUESTION FOR THE COMMISSION. YOU KNOW, I, UH, MOST PEOPLE WHO COME IN FOUND OUT THROUGH WORD OF MOUTH BY KNOWING SOMEBODY WHO HAD FILED A, A PREVIOUS CHARGE. UH, THERE, THERE HAVE BEEN A FEW WHO HAD FOUND OUT, YOU KNOW, THROUGH THEIR CHURCH, BECAUSE WE, YOU PUT BROCHURES IN SOME CHURCHES. UH, BUT YOU, THAT IS A QUESTION THAT'S ASKED ON THE FORUM IS, HOW DO YOU HEAR ABOUT THIS? AND I THINK THE MAJORITY, THEY SAY WORD OF MOUTH, UH, YOU KNOW, THROUGH A FRIEND. UH, I, IT'S, IT'S, UH, I GUESS I WANNA SAY, IT'S DIFFICULT TO PROMOTE SOMETHING IN A TOWN THAT HAS VERY LITTLE PUBLIC NEWS MEDIA. UH, YOU KNOW, UH, IT'S ALWAYS TALK, YOU KNOW, OLD PEOPLE TALK ABOUT BACK IN THE DAY, BUT WHEN, WHEN THERE WAS A NEWSPAPER WITHOUT HOW MANY REPORTERS WERE LOCAL REPORTERS, 15 OR SO, UH, AND NOW THEY HAVE MP THREE, UH, YOU KNOW, AND, AND PEOPLE READ THE NEWSPAPER, YOU KNOW, THE NEWSPAPER, ALMOST EVERYBODY READ THE NEWSPAPER EVERY DAY. UH, AND SO THERE'S NO, SOME, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE CAN LISTEN TO THE RADIO OR WATCH TV, BUT IT'S NOT THE SAME LEVEL OF COVERAGE. AND SO IT'S THE, THE NEWSPAPER USED TO COVER THESE MEETINGS, AND THERE'D BE A STORY IN THE, IN THE NEXT MORNING'S PAPER ABOUT THE FOUR O'CLOCK MEETING TODAY. YOU KNOW, AND THAT'S, SO I, I GUESS I'M KIND OF THINKING, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU GO ABOUT LETTING THE PUBLIC KNOW ABOUT ANYTHING, LET ALONE THE EXISTENCE OF THE HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION JUST NAGS AT ME ONCE IN A WHILE. AND I THINK WE'VE MADE APPEARANCES AT SOME PUBLIC, UM, FUNCTIONS TO DO WHAT WE COULD TO, UH, SPREAD THE WORD AROUND. I, I THINK I WILL DROP THE POINT HERE, BUT IT JUST SEEMED AS THOUGH, UH, WE SHOULD REFLECT EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE THAT WE'RE DOING EVERYTHING THAT WE CAN THINK OF, OF, TO MAKE PEOPLE KNOW THAT THIS PROCESS IS AVAILABLE TO THEM. SO WITH THAT, I'LL THANK YOU, . IS THERE ANY WAY WE COULD UTILIZE SOCIAL MEDIA? UH, WE'RE KIND OF ALL OF THE VINTAGE THAT WE DON'T USE IT THAT MUCH. WELL, DOES THE COMMISSION ITSELF HAVE A FACEBOOK PAGE? I, I BELIEVE WE DO. UM, SHERRY, ARE, ARE YOU STILL OVER THAT? YES. DOES IT HAVE ANY PARTICULAR ARTICLE OR, OR NOTIFICATION ABOUT WHAT WE'RE ALL ABOUT? YES. OKAY. WHAT, UH, WHAT'S THE, UH, TITLE OR WHATEVER THE FACEBOOK PAGE, IF I WANNA FIND IT? . [00:10:01] I THINK A CITY OF DECATUR, HUMAN RELATIONS. OKAY. BUT NOW, DOES, DOESN'T, DON'T PEOPLE HAVE TO FOLLOW IT IN ORDER TO GET, I MEAN, IF SOMEONE'S JUST ON SOCIAL MEDIA, THEY'RE NOT, THEY'RE NOT GONNA JUST AUTOMATICALLY, YOU KNOW, GET NOTIFICATIONS. SO I DON'T KNOW HOW, I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY HOW THAT ALL WORKS. NO. UM, IF YOU KNOW IT'S THERE, YOU CAN FOLLOW THAT WAY. BUT LIKE YOU SAID, IF YOU DON'T KNOW, YOU DON'T FOLLOW MY FRIENDS. FOLLOW, BECAUSE IT'S CONNECTED TO MY FACEBOOK PAGE. OH. YOU KNOW, SO, UM, BUT ANYBODY ELSE, IF YOU DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT IT, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO KNOW. IS, IS THAT SOMETHING I KNOW THE CITY HAS A COMMUNICATIONS MANAGER THAT'S, THAT'S IN THE HR OFFICE, ACTUALLY. I MEAN, HE'S NOT PART OF THE HR DEPARTMENT, BUT HIS OFFICE IS LOCATED. I WONDER IF THAT'S, THAT WOULD BE PART OF HIS, SOMETHING. HE COULD, I MEAN, WE CAN ASK HIM. I MEAN, HE CAN PUT IT ON, PROBABLY ON THE FACEBOOK PAGE. UM, TWITTER, I THINK HE HAS A SAID HE HAS A TWITTER AND FACEBOOK, I THINK. I'M NOT FOR SURE. YEAH, HE'S ON SOCIAL MEDIA. HE'S GOOD WITH SOCIAL MEDIA. I'M NOT A SOCIAL MEDIA PERSON. SO, UM, I'LL CHECK WITH RYAN AND, UM, SEE WHAT HE SUGGESTS. I REALLY APPRECIATE THAT, AND I KNOW MARK DOES TOO. . THANK YOU, MR. SPAN. UM, SHALL WE RETURN TO THE APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES FROM NOVEMBER 21ST? UH, THEY'VE BEEN DISTRIBUTED AND I HOPE SOMEBODY, MOST OF YOU HAD A CHANCE TO GO THROUGH IT SO THAT WE COULD GET A MOTION SOONER RATHER THAN LATER. WELL, I DON'T THINK YOU WERE AT THE LAST MEETING. OKAY. SO YOU'LL HAVE TO ABSTAIN. YOU'LL, YOU'LL HAVE TO ABSTAIN. BUT THANK YOU. ANYWAY. I APPRECIATE YOU. I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE OF THE MINUTES. SECOND, COMMISSIONER PELL'S MOVES AND COMMISSIONER KELLER. SECONDS. SHALL WE TAKE THE ROLL? COMMISSIONER? I'M SORRY. COMMISSIONER SLEETER ABSTAIN. COMMISSIONER KELLER? AYE. COMMISSIONER PALS? AYE. COMMISSIONER EER EHLER. AYE. CHAIR FAVOR? AYE. WE HAVE 5, 4, 4 AYE. AND TWO ABSTENTIONS. THANK YOU FOR THAT. UM, I THINK WE CAN GO INTO THE UNFINISHED BUSINESS AND TRY TO FINISH OUT ON CHAPTER 28 OF OUR, UM, EPIC, UH, DISCUSSION AND RENEWAL OF THE, UM, CHAPTER 28. AND WHO WANTS TO START THE BALL ROLLING. SO I HAVE A, WELL, I WANNA TELL YOU WHAT YOU HAVE, AND THEN I HAVE THREE, UH, COMMENTS, UH, FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION. WELL, ONE, FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION AND, AND ONE KIND OF A QUESTION, I GUESS. UH, SO YOU HAVE TWO VERSIONS THERE. UH, THEY, THEY LOOK THE SAME ON THE TOP, BUT ONE HAS SOME RED, UH, FONT, SOME WORDS IN RED. THIS IS THE ONE IN RED IS ONE THAT SHOWS ALL WHERE ALL THE CHANGES HAPPENED, SO THAT, UH, WHEN IT GETS TO THE REVIEW STAGE, THEY CAN SEE WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE BEFORE. 'CAUSE THAT'S CROSSED OUT, WHAT'S BEEN ADDED, WHAT'S BEEN CHANGED. AND THERE'S FOOTNOTES ON THAT SAYING IN MANY CASES, SAYING THIS IS, UH, THESE ARE EXAMPLES OF OTHER MUNICIPALITIES OR, OR OF THE STATE THAT USES THIS LANGUAGE SO THAT, THAT COULD SPEED UP THE REVIEW BECAUSE IT'S, IN MOST CASES, IT'S NOT STUFF THAT WE PROVIDED. IT'S STUFF THAT WE FOUND IN OTHER, UH, THAT OTHER CITIES USE. SO THAT'S A PRETTY DETAILED VERSION. THAT'S YOUR RED LETTER VERSION. THE OTHER ONE IS WHAT WE CALL A CLEAN COPY. IT'S, IT HAS WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE IF IT WERE PASSED BY CITY COUNCIL TODAY WITH THE CHANGES YOU RECOMMENDED. OKAY. SO THE REASON WE DID THIS IS IT, MY SUGGESTION TO PENNY WAS THAT WE NOT MOVE FORWARD WITH IT UNTIL YOU AS A COMMISSION HAVE ANOTHER MONTH [00:15:01] TO LOOK AT IT CAREFULLY AND REVIEW IT, AND THAT WE SCHEDULE THE FORMAL RECOMMENDATION FOR NEXT MONTH. SO, UH, THAT, THAT'S WHAT YOU HAVE AND THAT'S WHY YOU HAVE TWO VERSIONS. SO IF YOU WANNA SEE WHAT WAS, IF YOU WANNA SEE WHAT IT WOULD LOOK LIKE, USE THE CLEAN VERSION. IF YOU WANNA SEE WHERE THE CHANGES WERE, USE THE RED LETTER VERSION. UH, OKAY. THAT'S NOW THAT, NOW THAT YOU HAVE THAT, UH, IN YOUR HEAD, UH, THERE'S A COUPLE OTHER THINGS. UH, ONE IS THAT I, I NOTICED AS I WAS GOING THROUGH THAT, THAT THE FORMATTING IS NOT CONSISTENT. SOMETIMES IT'LL GO FROM AN ARTICLE TO, TO A, B, C. SOMETIMES IT'LL GO 1, 2, 3. AND PENNY'S ASKED ME TO CLEAR THAT UP AS WELL. UH, SO BEFORE WE COME BACK, UH, IT, IT'S THINGS YOU PROBABLY WOULDN'T NOTICE, BUT, BUT YOU NOTICE IF YOU SPEND ALL DAY WITH THESE THINGS, THAT SOMETIMES THE, IT USES DIFFERENT, DIFFERENT OUTLINE SYSTEMS, IF YOU WILL. SO, UH, WE WANNA GET THAT SO IT'S CONSISTENT. SO IF, SO EVERYTHING GOES FROM THE SECTION NAME TO A, B, C, AND SO FORTH. I DO YOU FOLLOW WHAT I'M SAYING? JUST THAT'S KIND OF A MINOR ISSUE. BUT, BUT THAT, WE'D LIKE TO GET THAT CLEARED UP, AND I FRANKLY DIDN'T HAVE TIME TO WORK ON THAT BEFORE THIS MEETING. UH, SECOND THING, AND THIS IS KIND OF A LAST MINUTE THING, SO DO WITH WHAT YOU WANT. UH, THE STATE RECENTLY ADDED A PROTECTED CHARACTERISTICS CALLED FAMILY RESPONSIBILITIES. AND WHAT THEY WERE TRYING TO GET AT WAS PEOPLE WHO WERE TAKING CARE OF CHILDREN WERE A PROTECTED CLASS. UH, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE WANT TO GO THERE. WE DO HAVE, AS A PROTECTED CLASS, MARITAL STATUS, AND SOME PLACES HAVE CHANGED MARITAL STATUS WITH FAMILIAL STATUS. IN OTHER WORDS, YOUR STATUS AS A FAMILY RATHER THAN MARRIED VERSUS UNMARRIED. SO RATHER THAN SAYING MARITAL STATUS, THEY SAY FAMILIAL STATUS. F-A-M-I-L-I-A-L. UH, AND THAT HAS BEEN DEFINED AS THE STATUS OF BEING A SPOUSE, DOMESTIC PARTNER, OR CIVIL UNION PARTNER, OR BEING RELATED TO ANOTHER, WHETHER BY BLOOD MARRIAGE OR ADOPTION. UH, SO IT, IT EXPANDS IT BEYOND BEING MARRIED OR NOT MARRIED TO, YOU KNOW, HAVING FOSTER CHILDREN, UH, ADOPTED, UH, CIVIL ALSO INCLUDES CIVIL UNIONS, WHICH I BELIEVE ILLINOIS STILL HAS CIVIL UNIONS ON THE BOOKS. THERE MAY BE, UH, COUPLES WHO HAVE BEEN CIVIL UNION AND NEVER ACTUALLY GOT MARRIED AFTER THE, THE MARRIAGE EQUALITY ACT WAS PASSED. I'M LOOKING AT YOU, MARK, I DUNNO, I ASSUME YOU'RE THE ILLEGAL EXPERT ON THIS . I, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT, UH, INVOLVED WITH MANY, UH, NOT TYING EVENTS THESE DAYS, , SO, YEAH. YEAH. BUT, UH, I AGREE WITH YOU. I THINK WE SHOULD CHANGE IT TO FAMILIAL STATUS. UH, UH, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LARGE POPULATION OF PEOPLE THAT JUST DON'T GET MARRIED, SO YEAH. SO THAT WOULD JUST ADD TO THE DEFINITION THERE. WE, WE'D INSERT THE DEFINITION OF MARITAL STATUS. UH, WHOA, I'M LOOKING AT MY RED LETTER EDITION. I'M MISSING A COUPLE PAGES. I GO FROM PAGE, OH, HERE, IT'S NEVERMIND. OH, WE JUST, IT'S ON, UH, ON YOUR RED LETTER VERSION. IT'S ON THIRD PAGE, UH, LETTER K. UH, WE'D REPLACE THAT WITH FAMILIAL STATUS. SO I JUST GET SOME MARK'S EXPRESS AN OPINION. THAT'S, THAT'S ONE COMMISSIONER. WHAT, WHAT THE OTHER COMMISSIONERS FEEL ABOUT THAT, THEN, DOES THAT CHANGE? THE MEANING, UH, YOU KNOW, IT SAYS MARITAL STATUS MEANS, YOU KNOW, LEGAL STATUS OF BEING MARRIED, SINGLED, SEPARATED, DIVORCED, OR WIDOWED. SO IF YOU HAVE FAMILIAL STATUS, DOES THAT, DO WE HAVE TO GO TO THE DEFINITION THAT THEY HAVE THERE THEN? YEAH, WE WOULD GO TO THE DEFINITION THAT I READ THERE, WHICH WOULD INCLUDE, UH, SAY FOR EXAMPLE, DISCRIMINATION, UH, AGAINST YOU BECAUSE, UH, [00:20:01] OF, SAY YOU WERE MARRIED TO SOMEBODY, YOU KNOW, UH, AND YOU, LET'S SAY WE, WE HAD A CASE SEVERAL YEARS AGO WHERE, UH, UH, AS I THINK IT WAS DOMESTIC PARTNERSHIP AS A HETEROSEXUAL COUPLE, BY THE WAY, BUT THEY WERE NOT MARRIED, BUT SHE CLAIMED THAT SHE WAS WHITE. SHE CLAIMED SHE LOST HER JOB BECAUSE HER HUSBAND WAS BLACK. COULD BE, I MEAN, WE NEVER GOT TO THE POINT OF INVESTIGATING THE CASE BECAUSE SHE WITHDREW THE CHARGE. BUT IN A CASE LIKE THAT, THAT WOULD EXTEND THAT KIND OF PROTECTION AS I UNDERSTAND IT. COULD YOU REPEAT THE DEFINITION THEN? I'M, I'M INCLINED TO, UH, GO WITH, WITH WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, THE STATUS OF BEING SPOUSE, DOMESTIC PARTNER OR CIVIL UNION PARTNER, OR BEING RELATED TO ANOTHER, WHETHER BY BLOOD MARRIAGE OR ADOPTION. SO ANOTHER, ANOTHER THING THAT WOULD DO, UH, IS, UH, SAY LIKE IN IN RENTAL HOUSING, SOMEBODY SAYS THAT WE'RE NOT GONNA RENT TO YOU BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT LEGALLY MARRIED. UH, THIS WOULD GET EXTEND PROTECTION FOR THEM. UH, ALTHOUGH YOU COULD KIND OF INTERPRET THE CURRENT ONE TO MAYBE, MAYBE THAT WOULD, UH, OR WE'RE NOT GOING TO RENT TO YOU BECAUSE YOU'RE A FOSTER PARENT, OR YOU HAVE ADOPTED CHILDREN OF A DIFFERENT RACE, WHATEVER. SO THE, THE DISCRIMINATION IS BASED ON THEIR, NOT ON THEIR PERSONAL CHARACTERISTICS, BUT THE CHARACTERISTICS OF THE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN THEIR FAMILY. I'M, I'M ASKING THIS, UM, MORE OUT OF, UM, IGNORANCE, BUT I, I HEAR THE TERM COMMON LAW USED A LOT, ESPECIALLY IN MARITAL STATUS. MM-HMM . IS, IS THAT ACTUALLY LAW, OR IS THAT JUST SOMETHING THAT IS REFERRED AND, AND I DON'T EXPECT ANYBODY TO KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT, BUT I'M JUST BRINGING THAT UP OF, OF SOMETHING THAT IS KIND OF RELATED IN WITH THIS. UH, I DON'T KNOW. IT WAS LIKE, IF YOU'VE LIVED TOGETHER FOR SEVEN YEARS OR 10 YEARS OR SOMETHING, THAT WOULD BE YOUR COMMON LAW WIFE OR HUSBAND OR PARTNER. I'VE HEARD THE SAME THING, BUT YEAH. BUT I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THAT'S LEGAL OR NOT. I DUNNO IF ILLINOIS, I DON'T THINK IT'S HERE, ILLINOIS. WHAT I HEARD, I DUNNO. I MIGHT BE WRONG. YEAH. I THINK IT WAS STATE BY STATE BASIS. AND I'VE NEVER HEARD THAT FOR ILLINOIS WATCHING TOO MUCH TV. I'VE HEARD PEOPLE, I'VE HEARD PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, CALL THEMSELVES THAT OR SAY THAT ABOUT OTHERS, BUT I, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S A LEGAL TERM OR NOT. SO DO WE HAVE A CON A CONSENSUS ABOUT, UM, ADOPTING THE FAMILIAL STATUS TERMINOLOGY AND THE DEFINITION THEREOF? NO. IF YOU LIKE THIS IDEA, I THINK WE'RE INCLINED TO DO THAT. OKAY. I MAKE MYSELF A NOTE HERE. OKAY. AND THE LAST THING, AND THIS IS KIND OF A, UH, I'M JUST GONNA THROW THIS OUT THERE AND ASK FOR GUIDANCE, I GUESS, DO YOU REMEMBER AT THE LAST MEETING, I BELIEVE IT WAS, UH, WE PULLED OUT ARTICLE 10 OR SECTION 10. THERE, SECTION IN ARTICLE ARE THE SAME THING, BECAUSE IT DEALT WITH MINORITY BUSINESS CONTRACTING BY THE STATE. AND IT WAS, AND IT, AND IT MENTIONED THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC WORKS WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR THAT PARTICULAR SECTION. AND SO, UH, THE COMMISSION THEN ASKED PENNY TO GET IN TOUCH WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC WORKS AND TO GET THEIR RESPONSE. THEIR RESPONSE CAME IN, AND I, WE PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE MADE COPIES OF THIS, BUT, UH, UM, THEY HAD SEVERAL, OR NOT SE THEY HAD A FEW SUGGESTIONS AS TO DEFINITIONS. UH, BUT I'M NOT SURE WHAT TO DO WITH THEIR RESPONSE BECAUSE IT'S, IT'S A DIFFERENT CITY DEPARTMENT THAN, THAN WHAT THE COMMISSION, THE COMMISSION IS ATTACHED TO THE DEPARTMENT OF, TO THE HR DEPARTMENT, HUMAN RESOURCES, PUBLIC WORKS IS A DIFFERENT DEPARTMENT. UH, AND AS THEY, AS, UH, MATT NEWELL, THE DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS, LOOKED AT THIS. HE NOTED SOME THINGS THAT EITHER HE HAD QUESTIONS ABOUT, UH, OR HE THOUGHT SHOULD BE CHANGED. SO HE THOUGHT THE DEFINITION OF MINORITY, THAT IT SHOULD BE MORE SPELLED OUT. AND HE SUGGESTED ONE THERE. UH, HE HAD SOME, SOME FORMATTING ISSUES, WHICH ARE NOT, NOT THAT IMPORTANT. UH, BUT THEN, UH, [00:25:02] THERE'S, THERE'S A PIECE IN THERE THAT SAYS MINORITY PARTICIPATION GOALS SHALL BE REVIEWED ANNUALLY BY THE CITY MANAGER, THEIR DESIGNEE, ANY CHANGES SHALL REQUIRE A MAJORITY VOTE OF CITY COUNCIL. UH, MATT SAID, OR MR. NEWELL SAID, I'M NOT SURE THE CITY MANAGER EVER REALLY REVIEWS THIS. IS THIS SOMETHING THE HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION CAN TAKE ON? SO SUGGESTING THAT MAYBE THE COMMISSION MIGHT ACTUALLY MONITOR, UM, MINORITY BUSINESS ENTERPRISE GOALS FOR THE CITY. I WILL SAY THAT SOME OTHER CITIES DO THAT, THAT THAT'S A ROLE OF THE HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION. THAT'S KIND OF A BIG CHANGE. 'CAUSE THAT GETS THE COMMISSION, FIRST OF ALL, IT GIVES YOU ANOTHER ASSIGNMENT THAT'S FAIRLY SIZABLE, AND IT WOULD THEN, UH, UH, ANYWAY, I GUESS THAT'S THE MAIN THING. IT WOULD, WOULD DO THAT. AND, UH, BUT IT'S A, WOULD BE A PRETTY BIG, PRETTY BIG CHANGE, UH, FOR THAT. BUT, BUT, AND THAT WAS A QUESTION HE ASKED. IT WASN'T A SUGGESTION. AND THEN THERE WAS A, THE LAST THING THAT MS. RENEWAL HAD WAS THAT, UH, UNDER SECTION TEN FOUR, IT SAYS, THE PUBLIC WORK DIRECTORS OR THEIR DESIGNATE DESIGNEE OR THIRD PARTY CONTRACT SHALL ADMINISTER AND ENFORCE THE POSITIONS, MON PROVISIONS, THE ARTICLE MONITOR REPORT TO THE CITY COUNCIL. AND HE SAID, UH, WE DON'T REALLY KNOW. WE STRUGGLE WITH THIS, AND WE'D WELCOME SUGGESTIONS FOR A GOOD THIRD PARTY CONTRACTOR COULD ASSIST WITH THIS. UH, AGAIN, THERE'S, THOSE ARE SOME SUBSTANTIAL COMMENTS. I DON'T KNOW, UH, WHERE TO GO WITH THEM. I MEAN, I, UH, WHETHER THAT WOULD BE DISCUSSION WITH PUBLIC WORKS, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER I, I'M JUST NOT SURE. AND I, UH, I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, AT ONE POINT YESTERDAY, PENNY, I THINK, WELL, I COULD JUST INCORPORATE THESE CHANGES, BUT THEY'RE REALLY NOT, SOME OF THEM ARE MORE QUESTIONS THAN CHANGES. AND, UH, I MEAN, IT WOULD BE NICE THAT WHEN WE PRESENT THIS, WE PRESENT THE WHOLE THING. NOT EVERYTHING, BUT ARTICLE 10. BUT I DUNNO IF YOU'VE HAD ANY MORE THOUGHTS ON HOW WE PROCEED WITH THE, THE COMMENTS FROM PUBLIC WORKS. YOU KNOW, I REALLY HAVEN'T, UM, THOUGHT MUCH MORE ABOUT IT. BUT I'M JUST WONDERING, UM, HOW THE COM I DON'T KNOW IF THE COMMISSION CAN REALLY BE MORE INVOLVED IN, IN THAT, BECAUSE IT'S SO SPECIFIC TO PUBLIC WORKS. AND I, I JUST DON'T KNOW LOGISTICALLY HOW THAT WOULD WORK. I THINK THE EXPERTISE WOULD BE MUCH MORE AVAILABLE IN THE PUBLIC WORKS DEPARTMENT THAN AMONG US, UH, CIVILIANS. BUT ISN'T, ISN'T IT MORE JUST TO MONITOR TO SEE THAT THE, UM, REQUIREMENTS HAVE BEEN FOLLOWED? UH, I THINK, YEAH, I THINK IT, WHAT, WHAT EXPERTISE DOES THAT TAKE? SO PROBABLY BE, I DON'T KNOW. I, I'M GUESSING YOU'RE, YOU'RE PROBABLY CLOSE TO THE TRUTH THAT, THAT THE, UH, YOU KNOW, THE CITY HAS MINORITY PARTICIPATION GOALS, AND I TRYING TO FIND OUT WHERE THAT IS IN, IN THE LANGUAGE. UH, OKAY. YEAH. THE, UH, SECTION TEN THREE GIVES MINORITY PARTICIPATION GOALS FOR PUBLIC PROJECTS. UH, SO I'M GUESSING THAT IT WOULD BE RECEIVING REPORTS FROM PUBLIC WORKS. THEY'D HAVE TO PREPARE THE REPORT SAYING, YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE ARE WE ON MINORITY PARTICIPATION GOALS? I'M GUESSING THAT THE CITIES THAT INCLUDE THIS IN THERE DO HAVE FULL-TIME STAFF FOR THEIR HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION. 'CAUSE UH, MOST OF THE OTHER CITIES DO. WE DON'T. UH, SO STILL, I THINK WE WOULD HAVE TO FIND SOME WAY TO EDUCATE OURSELVES IN THE PARAMETERS OF THE MINORITY, UH, HIRING GOALS TO KNOW WHAT WE'RE DOING, WHICH HIRING OR, OR, UH, CONTRACTING OR CONTRACT. YEAH. YEAH. IT'S CONTRACTING. NOT HIRING. YES. CONTRACTING. THEN, UM, PUBLIC WORKS CONTRACTS, RIGHT? IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT HIRING. WHAT IS THE LEARNING CURVE WOULD WE THINK AS FAR, IF WE WERE GONNA DIVE INTO THIS? YEAH, WE'RE, YOU KNOW, I'M, I'M KIND OF WONDERING IF MAYBE THERE SHOULDN'T BE DISCUSSION WITH THE CITY MANAGER BECAUSE IT INVOLVES TWO DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS, YOU KNOW, AND, UH, I DON'T, I MEAN, I FEEL VERY UNCOMFORTABLE WITH, I MEAN, I'M A HOWLY CONTRACTOR WITH THE HR DEPARTMENT, YOU KNOW, AND I [00:30:01] DON'T FEEL LIKE I SHOULD BE MAKING CITY POLICY OR, YOU KNOW, I, I, I THINK IT REALLY NEEDS, I THINK IT KIND OF FALLS ON THE CITY MANAGER'S DESK TO KIND OF SORT THIS OUT AND SAY, YOU KNOW, WHERE DO WE WANT TO GO? I DON'T, I, I MEAN, I, I DON'T, I, I FEEL LIKE I'M TOTALLY OVER MY PAY PAY GRADE HERE WITH, WITH THIS, WITH ARTICLE 10. DOES IT MEAN THAT SOMEONE WOULD BE ABLE TO BRING A DISCRIMINATION ALLEGATION TO US BECAUSE OF ARTICLE 10? IT DOESN'T, DOESN'T INDICATE WHAT A VIOLATION WOULD BE. IT SAYS IF THE CONTRACTOR, THE, OKAY, I'M ON PAGE 29 OF THE CLEAN COPY HERE. OKAY. THE VERY TOP HOP 29, IT STARTS, IT SAYS LETTER A. SO IF A CONTRACTOR FAILS TO MEET THE CITY'S MINORITY PARTICIPATION GOALS, FALSIFIES, MBE, MINORITY BUSINESS ENTERPRISE DOCUMENTATION, AND OR FAILS TO PROVIDE EVIDENCE OF A GOOD FAITH EFFORT TO MEET THE GOALS, THE PUBLIC WORK DIRECTOR OR THEIR DESIGNEE ME AS APPROPRIATE ORDER CORRECTIVE ACTION, ASSESS A FINE OR PENALTY AN ORDER THAT THE CONTRACTOR IS NOT CONSIDERED RESPONSIVE, RESPONSIBLE BIDDER FOR FUTURE PROJECTS. SO IT LOOKS, OH, WELL LOOK AT THIS. TEN SIX, I SHOULD HAVE READ THIS. THE PENALTY ASSESSED BY THE PUBLIC WORK DIRECTOR OR DESIGNEE, SHALL BE APPEALABLE TO THE HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSIONS. I READ THAT. OOH. WELL, INTERESTING. SO I GUESS THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION IS, YES, , THEY COULDN'T FILE A REGULAR CHARGE, BUT THEY COULD, UH, APPEAL TO THE COMMISSION, WHICH AS WE'VE SEEN, HAS, HAS EXTENSIVE EXPERTISE IN THIS AREA. , UH, I WONDER THEN IF THIS NEEDS TO BE PAIRED DOWN TO THAT KIND OF SPECIFIC, UH, AREA. YEAH. BECAUSE THAT SEEMS TO BE THE ONLY PLACE WE GET INVOLVED. BUT THIS IS, BUT THIS IS ALSO THE CITY ORDINANCE GOVERNING MINORITY BUSINESS ENTERPRISES. SO WE CAN'T, I MEAN, THAT, THAT, THAT DOESN'T APPEAR ANYWHERE ELSE. SO, SO IT'S AN IMPORTANT PIECE OF, OF THE CITY, UH, CODE. BUT, AND AS TO WHERE THE HUMAN RELATIONS COMMISSION FITS IN OR SHOULD FIT IN, FRED, WOULDN'T WE BE IN, UM, UH, KIND OF, UM, VIOLATION OF OURSELVES IF WE ALSO, IF WE WERE DOING MONITORING ABOUT THAT? AND THEN ALSO WE'RE ASKED TO BE, BE THE DECISION MAKER AT, AT, AT THE APPEAL. IT SEEMS LIKE WE, WE, WE CAN'T MONITOR SOMETHING AND THEN WE MIGHT BE ONE OF THE, UH, BODIES WHO WOULD, UH, BE LIABLE FOR NOT DOING THEIR JOB. AND THEN WE WOULD ALSO RULE ON AN APPEAL, UH, I, THAT THAT SEEMS TO BE CROSS, UH, CONTAMINATED, I GUESS, OR WHATEVER. YEAH, I SEE. WE, IT'S A CONFLICT, POTENTIAL CONFLICT OF INTEREST. UH, I THINK, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE YOU'RE, YOU'VE ALREADY YEAH, IT COMES RIGHT BACK. 'CAUSE YOU'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR MONITORING AND THEN THEY'RE SAYING, YOU KNOW, YOU YEAH, I THINK THAT'S PUTS PUTS YOU AS, AS A JUDGE AND JURY OR SOMETHING. YEAH, I WOULD AGREE. UH, I DON'T KNOW. IT, I DON'T KNOW. IT APPEARS TO ME THIS DOESN'T BELONG TO US. YEAH. AND EVEN THE APPEAL THING SHOULD BE WRITTEN UNDER THE PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR. YEAH. OR, OR APPEAL TO THE CITY MANAGER OR SOMETHING, YOU KNOW? YEAH. I MEAN, THAT'S, THAT'S THE ONLY PLACE WE GET INVOLVED. I MEAN, THE, THE REST OF IT, YOU KNOW, IT JUST DOESN'T SEEM TO FIT US. I DON'T, LIKE I SAY, WE MAYBE NEED TO TALK TO THE CITY MANAGER OR SOMEONE ELSE ABOUT THIS. YEAH. I DON'T KNOW THE HISTORY OF THIS ARTICLE AND I DON'T KNOW, UH, YOU KNOW, WHY IT CAME OUT THE WAY IT IS. IT'S BEEN BEEN THERE FOR A LONG TIME, I THINK. AND MY READING IS THAT, UH, THE, UH, WE DON'T MONITOR, IT SEEMS SECTION TEN FOUR THAT IT'S, IT'S, UH, THE NO, AND, AND IT'S NOT, THAT'S NOT IN THERE CURRENTLY. IT'S MR. NEWELL, YOU KNOW, ASKED THE QUESTION, WOULD WE WANT, WOULD WE WANT, IS IT SOMETHING THE COMMISSION WOULD WANT TO DO POINT [00:35:02] MM-HMM . BUT I GUESS THE OTHER THING WITH THIS THAT, YOU KNOW, UM, I, IT IT, IT SEEMS LIKE WE'RE, UM, WHAT POWER DO WE HAVE IN THE APPEAL PROCESS TO FIND, UH, IN FAVOR OF ONE PARTY OR ANOTHER? AND THEN, YOU KNOW, HOW DO WHAT ENFORCEMENT, UH, POLICY OR LEVERAGE DO WE HAVE WITH, I, I DON'T THINK THINK WE HAVE ANY, DO WE? YEAH, I MEAN, I, YEAH, I, IT DOESN'T GO ON TO SAY THAT I, IT'S, IT'S PROBABLY NEVER HAPPENED. I'M GONNA, YOU KNOW, I SHOULD GET CLOSER TO THE MICROPHONE. I DON'T BELIEVE IT'S PROBABLY EVER HAPPENED, BUT IT WOULD KIND OF MAKE SENSE TO ME THAT IF THERE'S AN APPEAL BEYOND THE PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR, I SHOULD GO TO THAT PERSON'S BOSS, WHICH WOULD BE THE CITY MANAGER. BUT, AND PENNY, I KNOW YOU'VE BEEN TRYING TO GET IN HERE. DO YOU REMEMBER THE OTHER CITIES WHEN YOU LOOKED AT THEIR ORDINANCES, DID THEY HAVE A SECTION ON MBE? SOME OF THEM DID. UH, AND SOME OF THEM, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE JOB OF THE COMMISSION TO MONITOR MBE STUFF. UH, AND AS I SAID, I THINK THOSE ARE PROBABLY CITIES THAT HAVE FULL-TIME STAFF ASSIGNED TO THE COMMISSION SO THAT THEY COULD ACTUALLY DO THAT. IT'S, IT'S, UH, UH, I COULD, I MEAN, I COULD SEE WHICH ONES DO AND WHICH ONES DON'T. I'M NOT, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT WOULD HELP. AGAIN, I'M NOT EVEN SURE, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT SURE WHERE TO GO WITH THE DISCUSSION. THAT'S, THAT'S THE, THAT'S REALLY THE ISSUE IN TERMS OF WHAT THE PROTOCOL IS WITHIN CITY GOVERNMENT BECAUSE, UH, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT PART OF CITY GOVERNMENT. I DON'T KNOW WHAT, WHAT, WHERE WE SHOULD GO WITH THIS. I CAN TALK TO, UM, THE HR DIRECTOR FRENCH WILSON ABOUT THIS, UM, BECAUSE I DON'T, I DON'T THINK I'VE TALKED TO HER ABOUT IT SINCE WE RECEIVED THOSE COMMENTS BACK FROM MATT NEWELL. YEAH. AND SEE, I MEAN, I'D BE GLAD, YOU KNOW, TO, OR, OR CHAIRS AKER YOU MEET WITH THE MANAGER OR TO MEET WITH MR. NEWELL AND THE MAN, JUST TRY TO SORT IT OUT SO THAT WE CAN, YOU KNOW, I, I, YOU KNOW, THE ONE THING I DO, I, I WANT THIS TO BE STRAIGHTENED OUT BEFORE WE GO FORWARD WITH THE THINGS. I DON'T WANT IT TO SAY THAT WE MEAN EVERYTHING EXCEPT THIS PART, YOU KNOW? BUT, BUT IT INVOLVES ANOTHER DEPARTMENT. AND SO WE NEED TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN. IT WOULD BE MORE EXPEDITIOUS IF THERE WAS A, UM, PRELIMINARY MEETING OF THE MINDS TO FIND OUT JUST WHAT IS BEING SOUGHT AND THE CHANGES THAT MIGHT HAPPEN, AND THEN BRING IT BACK TO THE COMMISSION, UH, AND MAYBE DECIDE ONE WAY OR ANOTHER IN WRAPPING UP THE, UH, REVIEW OF CHAPTER 28 SO I COULD MAKE MYSELF AVAILABLE. WHAT I, WHAT I DID HEAR AND IS THAT THE COMMISSION DOESN'T SEEM VERY INTERESTED IN BEING THE APPEAL BODY. UH, UH, EVEN GIVEN THE FACT THAT, THAT YOU DON'T MONITOR IT. I MEAN, THAT IF, IF IT'S MONITORING, THAT SHOULD BE ONE OR THE OTHER. BUT, BUT I ALSO KIND THOUGHT, I WAS HEARING THAT WE DON'T HAVE ANY EXPERTISE TO DO THIS STUFF. YOU KNOW, IT SHOULDN'T, IT WOULD TAKE ANOTHER BODY OF EXPERTISE IF WE'RE HANDLING APPEALS FROM MINORITY, FROM CONTRACTORS SAYING, YOU TOLD ME I HAD TO HAVE 10% MINORITY WORKFORCE AND I'VE ONLY GOT 2%. AND, BUT IT'S NOT MY FAULT. THEY'RE GONNA COME TO YOU AND YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO FIGURE OUT WHETHER OR NOT IT'S THEIR FAULT. AND THEN WHAT'S, WHERE DOES IT GO FROM THERE? WHO ENFORCES YOUR, YOUR DECISION? YEAH. I DUNNO. WELL, I, I, I AGREE WITH THAT TOO. I, I, I DON'T SEE HOW, UNLESS SOMETHING IS SPELLED OUT A LOT DIFFERENTLY, HOW WE COULD, UM, HANDLE THAT ROLE IN ANY EFFECTIVE WAY. SO IT WOULDN'T BE THE CASE THAT MR. NEWELL WOULD ACT IN AN ADVISORY ROLE ALONG THE LINES OF WHAT YOU DO FOR US. I DON'T KNOW. HE WOULD BE OUR EX OUR, OUR EXPERTISE. HE, HE COULD DESCRIBE, YOU KNOW, WHAT THIS, I MEAN, I GUESS MY SENSE IS WE SHOULD DO WHATEVER PUBLIC WORKS WANTS WITH THIS SECTION, BUT IT'S NOT, YOU KNOW WHAT, BUT, BUT HE'S GOT SOME QUESTIONS THERE SAYING KIND OF WHAT, WHAT'S THE BEST SYSTEM? I DON'T THINK HE'S AT ALL OPPOSED TO THE IDEA OF MBE, YOU KNOW, I DON'T SENSE THAT AT ALL. I THINK HE, HE SUPPORTS IT. IT'S JUST A MATTER OF HOW WE, HOW THE CITY, YOU KNOW, UPDATES THE STRUCTURE THAT'S THERE. SO. ALRIGHT. , SORRY TO, SO WHERE'S THIS BRING US IN THE LAST 14 MINUTES OF THE MEETING? YEAH, YEAH, YEAH. WELL WE HAVE IMPORTANT WORK HERE. DO [00:40:01] WE HAVE ANY OTHER, UH, SECTIONS TO, UH, CONCENTRATE ON AT THE MOMENT? ARTICLE IS 8 0 9 OR ARE WE SAYING THAT WE MIGHT BE CLOSE TO THE END OF THE LINE? WELL, YEAH, I WOULD JUST URGE YOU TO TAKE THAT AS SOME HOMEWORK TO LOOK THROUGH IT ONE, ONE MORE TIME AND WE'LL HOPEFULLY BY THE NEXT MEETING WE'LL KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH ARTICLE 10. UH, MEANWHILE I'LL, I'LL ADD THAT LANGUAGE ABOUT FAMILIAL STATUS AND SEND THAT BACK TO, TO PENNY SO SHE CAN DISTRIBUTE THAT. BUT THAT WOULD BE THE ONLY CHANGE WE HAVE AT THIS POINT. IS THERE, SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT FEBRUARY'S MEETING, UM, WOULD IT BE FEBRUARY OR MARCH THAT YOU WOULD ESTIMATE THAT, UH, THIS WOULD GO TO, UH, LEGAL, JUST THE TIMEFRAME BEFORE THE, THE, UH, END OF THE, THE END OF THE YEAR FOR OUR TERMS AND SUCH? OH YEAH. I THINK PART OF THE DISCUSSION WITH THE CITY MANAGER WOULD BE TO, TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S THE CORRECT PATH FOR IT TO GO TO LEGAL. BUT, SO I, THAT'S NOT A QUESTION I CAN ANSWER. IT'S JUST MY UNDERSTANDING THAT, UH, ONCE WE, UM, WRAPPED UP THINGS AND LOOKED OVER IT, UH, A FEW MORE TIMES THAT, UH, THAT WOULD BE THE REVIEW PROCESS BEFORE IT WOULD BE SUBMITTED TO THE CITY. EXCUSE ME. I THINK THAT'S BEEN OUR ASSUMPTION ALL ALONG. BUT THAT ALSO WAS A, A PREVIOUS CITY MANAGER, YOU KNOW, SO I THINK WE NEED TO JUST CLARIFY, YOU KNOW, UM, WHAT WE DO WITH IT WHEN WE'RE READY. DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? I CAN TRY TO FIND OUT MORE ABOUT THAT. UM, BECAUSE I'VE NEVER REALLY BEEN INVOLVED IN A REVISION TO A CITY COVE, SO I'LL FIND OUT MORE ABOUT IT. YOU'RE SAYING GO THROUGH THE, THE, UH, CLEAN ONE? 'CAUSE THE RED ONE IS DISREGARD. NO. NOW IF YOU WANT TO SEE WHAT'S CHANGED. YEAH. YOU LOOK AT THE RED ONE, RIGHT? ONE. YEAH. IF YOU WANNA SEE WHAT IT, WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE. HAS THAT ALREADY, THOSE YOU COULD, THOSE RED ONES HAVE ALREADY BEEN, WE'VE DECIDED ON THAT. THOSE HAVE BEEN DECIDED BY THE COMMISSION. OKAY. THE RED, THAT'S WHAT I, EVERYTHING IN THERE, EVERYTHING THAT'S IN RED HAS BEEN DISCUSSED AND DECIDED BY THE COMMISSION. BUT IF YOU'RE LOOKING TO SEE WHY WE GOT THAT DONE. YEAH. SO SOME PEOPLE ARE GONNA, WE USE ONE, SOME ARE GONNA USE BOTH, YOU KNOW? RIGHT. OKAY. BUT WE'RE JUST FINDING ANY, ANYTHING THAT THAT JUMPS OUT AT YOU. I THINK IT'S MM-HMM . RATHER THAN DOING IT HERE AT THE MEETING THAT RIGHT. TAKES SOME TIME AND DO IT AT HOME. AND CAN WE GET COPIES TO THE PEOPLE WHO ARE NOT HERE? SO THEY, I SENT THEM COPIES. OH, YOU DID? OKAY. I MEAN, OKAY. GOOD TO NOT HAND NOT PRINTED COPIES, BUT I EMAILED EVERYBODY GOOD. THIS INFORMATION. OKAY. I DO WANT TO EXPRESS MY APPRECIATION TO, TO FRED AND PENNY AND THE OTHER PEOPLE, UH, UH, SHERRY, WHO HAVE, UH, MADE THIS, UH, POSSIBLE. UH, IT'S, IT'S QUITE AN UNDERTAKING GOING THROUGH AN ENTIRE CHAPTER OF CITY CODE. SO, UH, THERE HAVE BEEN SOME, UH, SOME EYE-OPENING CHANGES AND, AND WE'VE, I FEEL GOOD THAT WE'VE, UH, BEEN GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE. SO, UM, DO YOUR HOMEWORK AND UH, COME BACK IN FEBRUARY. JUST READY TO ROLL. IS THERE ANY OTHER BUSINESS? HEARING NONE. I'LL TAKE A MOTION FOR ADJOURNMENT. MOTION AURN. SECOND. COMMISSIONER KELLER MOVED. AND COMMISSIONER SLEETER. SECONDED TO ROLL PLEASE? COMMISSIONER MCREYNOLDS? DID YOU BUTTON ON BUTTON? THAT BUTTON? YES. COMMISSIONER MCREYNOLDS [00:45:03] GIVE THE II A I I GUESS WHENEVER. COMMISSIONER SLEETER. AYE. COMMISSIONER EER. AYE. IS IT EER OR EER? EER. EER. OKAY. I AM SO SORRY. AND HOW LONG YOU BEEN A COMMISSION FOR ? UH, COMMISSIONER KELLER? AYE. COMMISSIONER PALS? AYE. AND CHAIR ZA AYE. WE HAVE SIX A'S AND NO NAYS. YEAH, I'VE BEEN ON OH. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.